More Brexit Debate

Ambrose Evans-Pritchard:

With sadness and tortured by doubts, I will cast my vote as an ordinary citizen for withdrawal from the European Union.

Let there be no illusion about the trauma of Brexit. Anybody who claims that Britain can lightly disengage after 43 years enmeshed in EU affairs is a charlatan or a dreamer, or has little contact with the realities of global finance and geopolitics.

Stripped of distractions, it comes down to an elemental choice: whether to restore the full self-government of this nation, or to continue living under a higher supranational regime, ruled by a European Council that we do not elect in any meaningful sense, and that the British people can never remove, even when it persists in error.

Donald Tusk:

Brexit Could Mean End Of Western Civilisation

REUTERS – If Britons vote to leave the European Union in a June 23 referendum it could be the beginning of the end for the 28-nation bloc and for western political civilisation more generally, European Council President Donald Tusk said.

In an interview with German newspaper Bild, Tusk said a so-called Brexit vote would provide a major boost to radical anti-European forces who he said would be “drinking champagne”.

“Why is it so dangerous? Because no one can foresee what the long-term consequences would be,” Tusk said. “As a historian I fear that Brexit could be the beginning of the destruction of not only the EU but also of western political civilisation in its entirety.”

Can anyone ever foresee what the long-term consequences of anything might be? We can never really know.

Paul Craig Roberts:

PCR:  They always pull out this argument of having a ‘place at the table’ argument in favour of Britain remaining in Europe. It’s been going on for decades from the British side. The logic is, if we’re at somebody else’s table, we COUNT. What has happened to this great nation? Liberty is a human achievement mainly achieved by the British over many centuries to get accountable government, and people protected by the rule of law. Law was taken out of the hands of government as a WEAPON and turned into a SHIELD to protect the people. The creation of liberty by turning law into a shield and not a weapon – that was the great British achievement. Now it’s all being thrown away.

JC:  So now the British people have an opportunity NOW to do the ‘right thing’ as Cameron would call it. A Brexit vote, even symbolic, could embolden people in other countries. So we do have a serious opportunity here, to vote for a much wider view and really change things.

PCR:  It’s a vote for humanity, for life on earth. What’s at stake is life on earth. It can change everybody’s mentality and convince others to disbelieve the propaganda mechanism of our governments. It says that people can see through the lies and propaganda – that’s the message, the important thing. It would influence people in other countries across the world as well as US and the EU. The propaganda basis of all western governments would disappear. It’s the only way people can get control back over their lives. Right now they have zilch, especially in the United States.

This might be interesting (my added emphases):

Welcome to FP Comment’s 18th annual Junk Science Week, dedicated to exposing the scientists, NGOs, activists, politicians, journalists, media outlets, cranks and quacks who manipulate science data to achieve their objectives. Our standard definition over the years has been this: junk science occurs when scientific facts are distorted, risk is exaggerated and the science adapted and warped by politics and ideology to serve another agenda.

Much of our content over the past 18 years has focused less on science itself and more on the NGOs, politicians and others who have found it convenient to use and abuse science as a springboard to political action. It is easy, perhaps too easy, to follow the empty-headed foibles of a media culture that mindlessly recycles reports that bacon may cause heart disease or that cell phones cause cancer. Less easy is dealing with the much bigger problem: the break down of science itself.

Of course Tobacco Control is guilty of distortion, exaggeration, and having its own twisted agenda. I wonder if the Financial Post will give it a mention? I won’t be holding my breath.

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About Frank Davis

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24 Responses to More Brexit Debate

  1. waltc says:

    I’ll be crossing my fingers (making an X) on June 23rd, which might be the beginning of civilization as we knew it.

  2. Some French bloke says:

    I won’t be holding my breath.

    A *very* sensible health warning, at last! The WHO should be spreading it far and wide…

    junk science occurs when scientific facts are distorted, risk is exaggerated …

    And to what avail, ultimately? So that other risks, largely – if not wholly – identifiable, are downplayed.

    Also from your link: http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/terence-corcoran-science-is-on-the-verge-of-a-nervous-breakdown:

    whole fields can be misdirected for decades (see nutrition, on cholesterol and sugar)

    Again, wWhat about the supposed noxious effects of tobacco smoking?

      • Rose says:

        Thank you, Prog.

        I wondered why both news channels were showing the questioning of Sir Phillip Green live without a break.
        Not so much as a mention on the tickertape or red button news pages.

        Brexit fleet of 60 boats sails past Gravesend en route to the Palace of Westminster in protest at fishing quotas
        14th June 2016

        “A 60-boat flotilla up the River Thames was expected to pass Gravesend this morning as part of the campaign to leave the European Union.
        Ukip leader Nigel Farage was to lead the fleet of British fishermen protesting against EU fishing quotas.

        The boats were due to set off from Southend-on-Sea in Essex at 5am and sail pass Gordon Promenade at about 7.30am, where Gravesham Brexit campaigners planned to cheer it on its way to the Palace of Westminster.

        In an interview with LBC Radio, Mr Farage said the flotilla would be “big, visual and dramatic”, with a clear message.
        “We want our waters back,” he said, before joking he would be in charge of cooking breakfast – eggs and bacon rather than continental.

        Photographer Jason Arthur, from Gravesend, planned to travel to Southend to capture the flotilla setting off up the Thames as it should be closer to shore than when it passed his hometown

        However, he said people in the town can get a closer view of the fleet when it makes its return journey later today.

        Fishermen from the east coast of England were set to join Mr Farage. The UK possesses 13% of the EU’s sea area and is allocated 30% of the current fish quotas.”
        http://www.kentonline.co.uk/gravesend/news/brexit-campaign-sets-sail-97380/

        REMAIN activists risk lives with co-ordinated attack on Nigel Farage’s Thames flotilla
        11:01, Wed, Jun 15, 2016

        “REMAIN activists today put lives at risk as they attempted to hijack Nigel Farage’s Thames Brexit flotilla with a co-ordinated and aggressive attack.”

        “Leave Vote campaigner Nigel Farage has been leading a flotilla of tens of boats down the Thames going past key sights of London today.
        The flotilla was part of the Brexit’s campaign in the last days before the referendum and Mr Farage was hoping to create a “big, visual and dramatic” sight.

        The Ukip leader is leading the fleet of British fishermen protesting against EU fishing quotas.”
        Fishermen from the east coast of England were joining Mr Farage. The UK possesses 13% of the EU’s sea area and is allocated 30% of the current fish quotas.

        Twitter user Steve O’Connell said: “Vote Leave flotilla proudly sailing by City Hall ‘Rule Britannia….’ springs to mind.”

        “The boats were decked in colourful flags and anti-EU banners in an attempt to galvanise as much support as possible days before the EU referendum.

        “Let’s put the Great back into Britain. Vote Out and be Great Britain again,” read a sign on one of the boats which were passing some of London’s most historic sights including Tower Bridge and the Houses of Parliament.

        Musician Bob Geldof joined a rival boat of Remain supporters who held up pro-EU banners in protest at the flotilla.”
        http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/680038/Farage-s-Brexit-flotilla-floats-down-Thames-European-Union-Brexit-London

        • prog says:

          ‘Musician Bob Geldof joined a rival boat of Remain supporters’

          That alone is good enough reason to vote out.

        • prog says:

          “REMAIN activists today put lives at risk as they attempted to hijack Nigel Farage’s Thames Brexit flotilla with a co-ordinated and aggressive attack.”

          FFS

        • Frank Davis says:

          Ooooh! A sea battle! I wonder whether it’ll be commemorated like Trafalgar?

        • Rose says:

          The express article updated.

          “The Boomtown Rats singer’s boat blared out music, including ‘Baby Please Don’t Go’, but were quickly drowned out as ‘Leave’ votes blasted their horns in protest.

          Mr Farage blasted Mr Geldof’s display as “just disgusting”.

          He said: “These are communities that have been devastated. These are communities that no-one has listened to for years.

          “They are here today, they have taken – some of them – several days out of their working week to come and make their protest, to say ‘look, we want to take back control of our seas, we want to get jobs back in this industry’.

          “To see multi-millionaires frankly mocking them is a pretty shameful sight.”

      • prog says:

        Warning – comments not as restrained or polite as here.

        This site is a break away from Guido Fawkes in response to his moderation policy. Regularly attracts 1000s of comments/topic.

        http://www.going-postal.net/2016/06/two-snappers-and-another-very-different-kind-of-fish.html#disqus_thread

  3. Rose says:

    Battle of the Thames: Is this what Bob Geldof thinks of British fishermen’s EU protest?
    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/680094/bob-geldof-nigel-farage-flotilla-thames-brexit-eu-referendum

      • nisakiman says:

        I had to reply to some of those smug, sanctimonious tweets. Ignorant twats.

        Maybe Farage has been reading your blog, Frank, and following some of the links that crop up in the comments so often. For him to say that he thinks that doctors have got it wrong on smoking is almost political suicide, so he must be pretty convinced.

        • Rose says:

          With any decision like quitting smoking or even buying a car, it’s important to do your own research.

        • Frank Davis says:

          Maybe Farage has been reading your blog, Frank

          I had the same thought, actually! After all, almost everybody has drunk the antismoking kool-aid. It’s pretty hard to find complete disbelievers like me.

        • smokingscot says:

          Googled the Farage quote (Ta, Roob).

          This one came up as having the fewest comments. None in fact.

          And he was on a boatie that made up the flotilla.

          http://www.scoopnest.com/user/MichaelPDeacon/743039735644467200

          However it carries the result of a poll that sums up the remainers’. 75% of that lot say it’s good to rely on experts.

          On the other hand only 33% of quitters’ share that view.

          So we’re a cynical bunch… but I kind of gathered that quite some time ago!

  4. Rose says:

    Remainers Disembark Geldof’s Boat in Disgust

    “Remain campaigners on board Bob Geldof’s pro-EU vessel disembarked in disgust after he made w*nker and V-signs at Brexit-backing fishermen:”
    http://order-order.com/2016/06/15/remainers-disembark-geldofs-boat-in-disgust/

    • nisakiman says:

      Well let’s admit it Rose, Geldorf is, and always has been a card-carrying tosser with a God-complex.

      • Rose says:

        Well yes, but if someone decides to arrange their own public execution, who am I to object?

        • prog says:

          He’s on question time tomorrow night

          Last week’s boost for Brexit…

          http://tinyurl.com/hkozuj3

        • Rose says:

          Geldof and Momentum lead river protest against Farage’s flotilla.

          “Momentum actvists and Bob Geldof have clashed with the “Farage Flotilla” as part of a bizarre day of EU campaigning on the river running past Parliament.
          Supporters of the In campaign squared up to the “Brexit flotilla” stunt which began when Leave campaigners launched boats on the Thames to protest against the EU’s fishing regulations.

          Bob Geldolf and fellow In campaigners met Leave flotilla with rival pro-Europe boats. The group attempted to drown out Nigel Farage’s messages with their own sound system.”
          “Activists from Corybnite faction Momentum also joined the response to the Brexit boats.”
          http://labourlist.org/2016/06/geldof-and-momentum-lead-river-protest-against-farages-flotilla

          They may not be quite so proud of themselves this morning.

  5. Joe L. says:

    OT: Check out the latest fear-mongering junk science:

    Very hot drinks are ‘probably carcinogenic’

    At least they used the word ‘probably’ in the title–I’m sure it’s only a matter of time before it’s ‘settled’…

  6. Steven says:

    I just hope geldorf releases a new record a week on Friday titled I hate Thursdays.

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