All Getting Rather Ugly

I said I doubted that it would be the end of it.

Despite saying that he would accept the result of the Scottish referendum, Alex Salmond isn’t going to:

Alex Salmond has raised the prospect of Scotland unilaterally declaring independence without another referendum as he abandoned his promise to accept the result and claimed that No voters were “tricked”.

Despite it being illegal, the First Minister argued the Scottish Parliament could say Scotland was leaving the United Kingdom at the point at which it had been devolved so many powers it was effectively independent.

The First Minister appeared to blame elderly Scots, who were most hostile to leaving the UK, for holding back younger generations and argued that independence is inevitable after they die off.

In a startling intervention, he also claimed that another referendum may not be required to break up Britain as the Scottish Parliament could unilaterally declare independence after gaining increasing numbers of powers.

Jim Sillars, his former mentor and a former SNP deputy leader, tweeted that the nationalists should “assert” a new rule that Scotland would become independent if separatist parties won a majority of votes and seats at the 2016 Holyrood election.

If I understand this right, Salmond didn’t get the result he wanted from the referendum, so he’s now proposing to dispense with democracy (and law), and have a secessionist majority in the Scottish Assembly declare independence anyway.

But given that we’ve just found out that 55% of Scots don’t want independence, they’re hardly likely to very happy to have independence thrust on them anyway. In fact, it looks to me just the sort of event that could ignite a civil war in Scotland between Unionists and Secessionists. After all, wasn’t it the secession of the American South from the Union that triggered the American Civil War? And isn’t the Ukrainian crisis a secessionist civil war?

And it would be a war that (as in America) the Unionists would almost certainly win, because they’d have not only the support of most Scots, but almost certainly the support of the Westminster government as well. And who would be supporting the Secessionists? When the American South seceded from the Union, no foreign state recognised the new Confederacy.

And, furthermore, that would probably be be the end of any dream of “inevitable” Scottish independence for the next 300 years.

Other secessionist movements have been watching closely:

Each of Europe’s aggrieved clans sent witnesses to Scotland for the vote. Some were nationalities seeking statehood, some more explosively seeking Anschluss with a mother country broken by victors’ cartography after the First World War.

The flaming red and yellow Senyera of the Catalans flew over Edinburgh. The German-speakers of the Sud-Tirol sent a delegation, careful not to violate Italian law by speaking too loudly of reunion with Austria. The Corsicans turned up. Flemings who could not make it lit candles on the Scottish Saltire in Brussels.

And in the case of Catalonia, ZeroHedge has a cartoon that explains the difference:

scotland_catalonia

Madrid has banned Catalonia’s pre-secession vote in November, or the “Consulta” as it is known, threatening “all available means” to stop it. The government has the constitution on its side, but critics say that is to hide behind the law in a political dispute that has already gone too far. At least a million Catalans came onto the streets last week for their “Diada” festival in what sounded like a collective roar of protest. Premier Artur Mas aims to press ahead with the vote regardless, invoking the Scottish precedent. “If it had been a Yes in Scotland, the road ahead would have been clearer, but what matters is not the way they voted, but the fact that they did vote. And we are in a stronger position because we have more social support.”

Not just Britain and Spain, but also Italy:

Eve Hepburn, an expert on secessionist movements at Edinburgh University, said the chain reaction is sweeping through Italy, already under volcanic stress. “Something peculiar is happening in Italy. A country reluctantly soldered together in the late 19th century looks like it’s beginning to come apart at the seams,” she said.

The rich Venetians – with their own ancient republic until Napoleon – have already had an online referendum. In June the regional council approved plans for a real vote.

The ruling Volkspartei in the Sud-Tirol just to the north threw down its own post-Scotland gauntlet on Friday, demanding fresh powers and a “real Europe of the Regions” on radically different foundations.

None of these stresses are eased in any way, of course, by the eurozone’s continuing recession, which impacts southern European states the hardest, and probably feeds secessionist tendencies throughout the EU.

Advertisements

About Frank Davis

smoker
This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged , , . Bookmark the permalink.

17 Responses to All Getting Rather Ugly

  1. harleyrider1978 says:

    Sounds like a Northern Ireland fight about to stir up and maybe in a lot of places not just Scotland.

    Does Scotland have an IRA equivalent

    • There was the SNLA (Scottish National Liberation Army) which had been founded “after the 1979 devolution referendum, which the organisation claimed was fixed.”

      They got around to sending a couple of letter bombs. Fortunately they were pathetic. Not even any kneecapping. Not as much as a Chinese burn.

      Who knows if a more effective group might follow now, especially with Salmond misbehaving? Although we’re rubbish at organising things in Scotland, which is why ‘independence’ would have been a failure in its suggested format with the greasy characters in Scottish politics possibly being the World’s most incompetent.

      But Salmond better be careful. One of the SNLA members, Andrew McIntosh, “was jailed for 12 years for conspiring to coerce the government into setting up a separate government in Scotland”.

      See what I mean about badly organised? They didn’t even have somebody competent at using basic graphics software…

      In 2002 Cherie Blair became a target of a renewed campaign by the SNLA when she was sent an anonymous parcel containing a vial that was crudely labelled as containing ‘Massage Oil’, but which on investigation actually proved to contain caustic acid. In addition a renewed letter bomb campaign was waged against Scottish politicians, parcels were recovered after a man claiming to be from the SNLA made an anonymous phone call to the police at Scotland Yard. Professor Paul Wilkinson opined at the time: “The SNLA has surfaced from time to time.”[4] Meanwhile, Busby may be targeted for extradition to America to face terror charges following a series of e-mails to America about how to contaminate US water supplies.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_National_Liberation_Army

  2. Richard says:

    I saw a video in which the presenter claimed that a friend had fallen into conversation with someone from a Scandinavian country at a railway station who claimed to work at the UN. She claimed that a “Civil war” was planned for the UK “in two years” – this was in 2012. I don’t remember the details as it was a throwaway line in a video about something else but it was made before the Scottish referendum.

  3. From The Telegraph piece,

    Johann Lamont, the Scottish Labour leader, said: “Having decisively lost a democratic referendum on independence, Alex Salmond is now suggesting the nationalists can ignore the sovereign will of the Scottish people.

    That’s rich coming from Labour. Anyways, General Salmondo has always ignored the mythical “sovereign will of the people”. His junta has introduced GIRFEC and its ‘named person’ as a surrogate state parent for every Scottish child; he ignored his own consultation on ‘same-sex marriage’ where nearly 2/3rds were against it (and I didn’t even bother to raise an objection as I knew it had already been decided); his ‘government’ overrules local councils on previously rejected planning applications for new wind farms because his intention is that we will be entirely powered by renewable energy by 2020 and he’s running out of time.

    Seems to me that the whole indepretence and devolution shenanigans is to feed the ever-expanding egos of a few politicians who don’t give two hoots mons about “the sovereign will of the Scottish people”.

    Perhaps more individuals will start to claim their own independence, like Stuart Hill whose one-man ‘country’ is the tiny Shetland Isle he calls “The Sovereign State of Forvik”. He does seem to have history on his side in that the Shetlands never seem to have been officially given to Scotland and therefore wouldn’t belong to the UK either. There must be get-out clauses for the rest of us who set up communities and can demonstrate (very easily) that the government doesn’t represent us and so we are justified in declaring our own independence.

  4. harleyrider1978 says:

    Chain-smoking is given as an example of excessive addictive behaviour in the DSM5.

    Well, looks like I’ve got another MI now.

    http://forums.psychcentral.com/other-mental-health-discussion/358855-smoking-mentioned-dsm5.html

  5. harleyrider1978 says:

    Scottish Independence Campaign Group ‘The 45%’ Announce Extensive Boycotting List

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/09/21/scottish-independence-the-45_n_5857906.html

    • smokingscot says:

      Given the paucity of fuel stations in Scotland, especially north of Inverness, it’s doubtful they’ll be willing to do a 20 mile detour to boycott a Shell or BP station.

      So, to screw the tiresome twits, all Asda needs do is put Grants whiskey and a few of the other “prohibited” brands on special offer and that’s their bubble popped!

      However while Salmond plays it to the 44.7% and threatens a Zimbabwe style UDI, do get one thing quite clear, try allowing customers to light up in your pub, club, cafe or greasy spoon and they’ll be down on you like a ton of bricks.

      I have a map on an ancient post that’s remarkably close to the referendum results. That’s the way the UK was – and that’s the way it’s heading now. Except for Orkney & Shetland; they too can declare UDI on the somewhat slimmed down, dreach and miserable land of wind farms, tidal and wave energy previously a patchwork of competing clans.

      http://www.smokingscot.com/mulling-scottish-independence.html

  6. harleyrider1978 says:

    Frank the Leftists have lost the LA TIMES EVEN

    West Coast warming linked to naturally occurring changes

    September 22, 2014, 4:46 PM

    Naturally occurring changes in winds, not human-caused climate change, are responsible for most of the warming on land and in the sea along the West Coast of North America over the last century, a study has found..

    The analysis challenges assumptions that the buildup of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere has been a significant driver of the increase in temperatures observed over many decades in the ocean and along the coastline from Alaska to California.

    http://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-pacific-warming-20140923-story.html

    India, China ignore UN climate change summit
    Chetan Chauhan, Hindustan Times New Delhi, September 23, 2014

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/india-china-ignore-un-climate-change-summit/article1-1267288.aspx

    OWEBUMMER is expected to be at the summit today along with a so called 122 country representation. Problem is its not the governments people showing up but those countries socialist nutcases from similar groups still pushing the fraud.

    • harleyrider1978 says:

      Michael J. McFadden commented on an article.

      September 21 at 5:04pm · .

      If you’ve ever wondered how and why “Global Warming” transformed into “Climate Change,” I’d recommend reading Michael Crichton’s 2004 novel “State of Fear.” I wish I had his talent and could write a similar “mainstream press” expose of the antismoking campaigners: the styles, tricks, language games, and campaign-building styles of the two movements are far more similar than most people realize. See this 2 minute clip of Crichton from 2007 where he briefly addresses the issue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGoZ-b1OaW4

      – MJM

  7. harleyrider1978 says:

    Tucker Carlson: Smoking in Children’s Cartoons a “Symbol of Freedom & Masculinity”

    By Tim Peacock

    ——————————————————————————–

    Tucker Carlson: Smoking in Children’s Cartoons a “Symbol of Freedom & Masculinity”
    While some conservatives long ago gave up the antiquated notion that smoking makes a person cool and masculine (just like the Marlboro Man!), one Fox News contributor just can’t seem to stop defending big tobacco. On Fox & Friends yesterday, Tucker Carlson defended smoking in cartoons claiming characters (such as Popeye) represent something other than subliminal cigarette sales campaigning.

    Commenting on the updated Popeye as imagined by Genndy Tartakovsky, Carslon agreed with a co-host that animators are attempting to “wussify” cartoon and comic book characters by removing cigarettes and pipes. “Of course, they’re wussifying,” Carlson said. “Nothing is scarier to a modern liberal than tobacco. If Popeye were driving around giving the morning after pill to fourth graders, that would be totally fine.”

    He continued, “But smoking a pipe, a symbol of freedom and masculinity in America itself, the reason this country exists, tobacco, that’s like, ‘Oh, that’s outrageous. That’s a major sin.’” [Emphasis Mine]

    According to Carlson, America only exists today because people in the Revolutionary era smoked cigarettes and pipes – at least, that’s the way he phrased it. Nevermind the battles, the bloodshed, the document we fought to create and sign that eventually began a country – no, we owe it all to big tobacco.

    Though the rest of the segment devolved into sexist banter relating to the new Thor and Wonder Woman’s outfit(s), you can’t ignore Carlson’s apparent ignorance of media history – especially since he’s a major media figure himself.

    The entire reason cigarettes originally appeared in advertising and cartoons was for advertising purposes. In fact, cigarette manufacturers in the 1960’s specifically targeted young audiences to lure them into smoking at a young age. The did this both through false health-related advertising campaigns (“More doctors smoke Camels”) and cartoons featuring beloved characters smoking.

    Two of the largest-watched televisions shows (by children and teens) of that era featured tobacco industry-sponsored smoking, in fact: The Flintstones and The Beverly Hillbillies,

    But Carlson’s historically tone-deaf statements don’t end with his absence of historical context concerning advertising to children; the Marlboro Man himself stood as a “masculine” smoking icon to entice then-current smokers to switch to filtered cigarettes – a product considered too ‘feminine’ up until that point.

    Having grown up in an era with his favorite television characters smoking and masculine cowboy father figures in advertising saying how cool and masculine filtered cigarettes make a person, it’s understandable how someone in his forties (or older) could reasonably still hold the mistaken beliefs Carlson espoused.

    Then again, Carlson isn’t a typical man in that age group; he’s a media personality with a journalistic responsibility to represent present and past events factually (something he most definitely didn’t do in this case).

    In their agreement to stop (blatantly) advertising to children, the tobacco industry admitted something several years ago Tucker Carlson still refuses to believe today: smoking in cartoons is less about patriotism and masculinity than it is about the almighty dollar and bringing in a new generation of smoking consumers at an impressionable age.

    I for one see nothing masculine or freedom-related about that concept.

    – See more at: http://www.peacock-panache.com/2014/09/tucker-carlson-smoking-in-childrens-10283.html#sthash.DNZjFVFI.dpuf

    Fox News comes out for the SMOKERS……………….So has a few New Jersey papers online that use to ban me after 1 post. Just like NOLA/PICAYUNE times that use to do the same thing………

    The MSM is turning on the NAZIS on every front………….

    • magnetic01 says:

      This Tim Peacock just wiped all the comments (18 of them) that didn’t fit with his [antismoking] history of smoking. He even deleted Harley’s query about why the comments were censored. What a bigoted hypocrite….. and he’s an LGBT activist!

      • harleyrider1978 says:

        Ya I know and I got back in after 30 minutes of creating new identities.

        he is also a Nazi for the smokefree folks. When I brought it up that they were among the highest smoking rates by group he even wiped my comments out but I got this back in at least as long as it stands.

        harleyrider1913 > Tim Peacock • 40 minutes ago

        Tim Why did you take all the posts down. I mean Im with you live and let live smoker or non……….Lets all be happy and get along. I fight for the right to smoke I don’t like discrimination no more than the LGBT community does………..We all deserve to be free and a place for all of us. You know the LGBT community is by far one of the heaviest smoking groups around and your for their rights correct. So lets not let junk science and claims deny those of a group you support and fight for.

        NOLA even started banning us all again after we wiped their clocks the last 2 stories.

        I got back in today with a new name and all only to watch them start deleting everything I said back to the Nazis making claims………….unreal but this time people were watching it happen!

        http://www.nola.com/music/index.ssf/2014/09/should_smoking_be_banned_in_ne.html

        • harleyrider1978 says:

          atpontchrtrn
          3 hours ago

          @bayouirish

          Um, noise level regulations in bars? Long in existence, Bayou.

          FlagShare
          1guiseppeLikeReply

          Jack40039334

          Jack40039334
          3 hours ago

          @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish actually there is proof after a certain DB level it harms the hearing………..Hense why AMA motorcycles mandated spark arrestors and mufflers for motocross races and they took Power meters to measure the noise levels.

          But with smoke they cant prove anything except from a fire where smoke inhalation was the source. Even then they recover perfectly. unless it was an acrid chemical that scarred the lungs and tobacco smoke doesn’t do that.

          Share
          LikeReply

          This comment has been deleted

          Platinum

          Platinum
          2 hours ago

          @atpontchrtrn @Jack40039334 @bayouirish

          Well said, and its just not rocket science. Its disheartening to hear some of these idiots come up with all these “tobacco doesn’t hurt you” BS. Some spoke of how smoker[s lungs are safe for transplant, as well as second hand is just fine.

          All those years of discussion just goes out the window by the flat-earth diehards.

          FlagShare
          2atpontchrtrnguiseppeLikeReply

          This comment has been deleted

          atpontchrtrn

          atpontchrtrn
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @Platinum @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish

          Haha article from “Environment and Climate News” published by Heartland Institute (the people who helped coin the phrase “junk science” to refer to any studies that their corporate donors didn’t like), a project of the Koch Brothers, see also Heartland Institute and Tobacco http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Heartland_Institute_and_tobacco

          FlagShare
          LikeReply

          Jack40039334

          Jack40039334
          2 hours ago

          @atpontchrtrn @Jack40039334 @Platinum @bayouirish

          The KOCH brothers are just as deep into anti-smoking and Obamacare as the rest……….they even donate and are in partnership with RWJF in anti=alcohol advocacy.

          Share
          LikeReply

          atpontchrtrn

          atpontchrtrn
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @Platinum @bayouirish

          They be your boss?

          FlagShare
          LikeReply

          FeelingMouthy

          FeelingMouthy
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish Tell that to my widowed Mom, who took care of my Dad as he was dying from lung cancer. Yes, a lifelong smoker. Jack, I presume you are a smoker as well. I don’t wish that kind of death on anyone. Are you willing you risk having a trach to back up your statement that tobacco smoke doesn’t scar (harm) the lungs? Go for it.

          FlagShare
          3StMaryDaveguiseppeatpontchrtrnLikeReply

          atpontchrtrn

          atpontchrtrn
          2 hours ago

          @FeelingMouthy @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish

          Though, I don’t believe that Jack40039334 is a smoker. The tobacco companies hire the smartest publicists, and they don’t tend to be smokers after being around all the inside information.

          FlagShare
          1StMaryDaveLikeReply

          FeelingMouthy

          FeelingMouthy
          2 hours ago

          @atpontchrtrn @FeelingMouthy @Jack40039334 @bayouirish Figures. So Jack. How would you feel about your children being exposed to second hand smoke for extended periods of time? Babies? That’s okie dokie, right? Cause surely you’re not a hypocrite.

          FlagShare
          2StMaryDaveguiseppeLikeReply

          Jack40039334

          Jack40039334
          2 hours ago

          @FeelingMouthy @atpontchrtrn @Jack40039334 @bayouirish

          Well since I was and my kids were too as they are now grown and smokers themselves. I cant see any problem with it at all. Why would you are you like a control freak or something.

          Share
          LikeReply

          FeelingMouthy

          FeelingMouthy
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @FeelingMouthy @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish Hardly. I support business owner’s right to choose. But don’t try to fool anyone by blowing smoke up our rear ends. I’ve seen firsthand the damage smoking does.

          FlagShare
          1guiseppeLikeReply

          Jack40039334

          Jack40039334
          2 hours ago

          @FeelingMouthy @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish

          You have and how did you connect the chemical pathways to determine this to disease causation……..

          Share
          LikeReply

          FeelingMouthy

          FeelingMouthy
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @FeelingMouthy @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish My father’s oncologist sees said his was the type of cancer which most commonly affects smokers. She ruled out with 99% certainty any other cause/exposure.

          FlagShare
          1StMaryDaveLikeReply

          This comment has been deleted

          This comment has been deleted

          This comment has been deleted

          atpontchrtrn

          atpontchrtrn
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish

          Jack never saw a smoking health study that showed other than it is really really good for us!

          FlagShare
          1FeelingMouthyLikeReply

          This comment has been deleted

          atpontchrtrn

          atpontchrtrn
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 @atpontchrtrn @bayouirish

          Well that’s quite an assumption, Jack. Why would I hate smokers? I think people who smoke deserve to be able to practice their chosen path in their own time and space, and that’s fine with me. I understand the power of the addiction, as I have been around it and understood it deeply. Once you start calling all studies “junk science” and claiming that nonprofit health groups like the Cancer Society are getting rich over not curing cancer or whatever you’re saying, you step outside the realm of sensible discussion.

          FlagShare
          1StMaryDaveLikeReply

          FeelingMouthy

          FeelingMouthy
          2 hours ago

          @Jack40039334 I don’t hate smokers either. I simply don’t care to be around it. It doesn’t take a Rocket Scientist to know that smoking is bad for you. After being around it for only a short time, my eyes and throat burn, my chest/lungs feel heavy and I stink. No thanks.

          FlagShare
          LikeReply

          Jack40039334

          Jack40039334
          33 minutes ago

          @atpontchrtrn @Jack40039334 @bayouirish

          So NOLA gets back to deleting the truth again. If you cant win the debate how do you expect the public to believe what you are trying to sale………………This should show the citizens of New Orleans that the anti-smoking activists in coercion with the media will do anything to avoid open debate on such a topic as smoking for fear their entire agenda will collapse and find its all been a fraud from the beginning.

  8. harleyrider1978 says:

    Now I know we have several folks in the fight who are liberal and conservatives along with Libertarians besides folks who have no real care about politics only that they just want their freedom back and will vote against the ones criminalizing them and thats the way it should be.

    But as most of us discovered the enemy crossed all political landscapes and AGENDAS………..They have had the MSM both right and left MSM news with them for a long time.

    But we all have known the same ones pushing anti-smoking were also the same wackos behind climate change,anti-obesity,anti-alcohol,anti-big gulps,anti-salt,anti everything and its finally starting to change………….

    What Im getting at is back in 1923 in Utah the NY TIMES and the LA TIMES both chastised the salt Lake city authorities to no end over arresting a few smokers in a restaurant. They made them a nationwide laughing stock, Then finally UTAH REPEALED THE LAST STATEWIDE SMOKING BAN.

    When I say look for the indicators of change the above example is one of thousands Im talking about………….

    It could likely be why the Nazis did that insane study about how comments section destroyed the MESSAGE last year…………Could be why everything is now on its way out it appears and well good riddance to it too.

    I like you simply want our lives back the way we were. We didn’t ask for this fight it was foisted upon us and we who loved our freedom and accepted the call,jump on board to end the oppression.

    Our politics isn’t what mattered it was what truly mattered to all of us,the basic right to freedom we all deserve regardless of anything else.

    Salute us all we’ve earned it.

  9. beobrigitte says:

    I said I doubted that it would be the end of it.

    Despite saying that he would accept the result of the Scottish referendum, Alex Salmond isn’t going to:
    Alex Salmond has raised the prospect of Scotland unilaterally declaring independence without another referendum as he abandoned his promise to accept the result and claimed that No voters were “tricked”.

    Every voter for anything everywhere is being “tricked”. That, if there is a chance to vote in the first place.

    Yep, all is set to get rather ugly.

  10. s a is mostly full of thirteen year old jerks

No need to log in

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s