Progressives and Conservatives

I think that ‘progressives’ always have some ideal future towards which they wish to progress. But the flip side of such progressivism is that progressives hate the present, and that’s why they want to change it into something else.

So the ‘progressive’ goal of a ‘smoke-free’ world  actually grows out of a hatred of smoke. It starts with hating something.

And the more radically ‘progressive’ you are, the more you hate the world the way it currently is.

And some people seem to hate absolutely everything. It often seems to me, for example, that Greens hate not just all human industry, but also the entire human race.

And I suppose that the opposite of a progressive is a conservative who likes the way the world is, and therefore sees no reason to change it. And an ultra-conservative is someone who loves the way the world, and wouldn’t change anything at all.

I’m not sure I’ve ever been much of a progressive. Because I’ve never much hated the way the world is. I’ve instead always been interested in it. Rather than condemn it, and make plans for what to replace it with, I have instead tended to wonder how it came to be the way it is, and come up with my own explanations.

So when, for example, I got thinking about the ancient institution of slavery, it wasn’t to condemn it, and be glad that it had been swept away by right-minded progressives, but to wonder why it had ever arisen in the first place. And my explanation was that it had arisen in antiquity because the only way back then of living a life of leisure was to force other people to do all the work. And if we don’t have slavery now, it’s not because we’re right-minded progressives, but because much of the burden of work has been passed over to machines – ranging from steam engines through internal combustion engines to electric motors and now computers. But for them, the institution of slavery would still exist. Which it did in the old, pre-industrial US South in about 1850, before it fought and lost a civil war with the newly-industrialised North. It would have maybe saved much blood if the Northern industrialists had invented machines to pick cotton and cut sugar cane, and sold them to their Southern neighbours to free the slaves that worked the cotton fields. But instead, the Northerners were seemingly only liberated by their new machines to become right-minded progressives, and to force their new values upon their Southern kinfolk.

I doubt if many Americans regret the demise of slavery. But progressivism doesn’t always make life better. In the post-WW2 era in Britain, much of the old stock of housing was torn down and replaced by tower blocks. This was another piece of progressivism. And it grew out of a hatred of the old back-to-back ‘slums’. Whether the ‘progressive’ new tower blocks were any better was actually rather doubtful, because they tore up communities and created a perfect environment for muggers in their corridors and walkways and malfunctioning lifts. And so 20 years after they’s been built, the tower blocks started being demolished, and replaced with low-rise housing which looked much like the old back-to-back terraces they’d replaced. The tower blocks might have looked good on the drawing board, but they didn’t work as functioning communities the way their predecessors had.

I think that the wave of smoking bans currently sweeping the world is another piece of dysfunctional progressivism. It may have looked good on the drawing board, and so much cleaner and tidier and healthier than the smoke-filled drinking dens that it set out to sweep away, but  – much like the 50s and 60s tower blocks – it shattered communities and bankrupted tens of thousands of pubs and clubs and cafes, as well as making pariahs of a quarter or more of the population. In short, it didn’t work. It did far more harm than good. And when this finally gets recognised, an attempt will be made to reconstruct the convivial culture that the ‘progressives’ destroyed.

And maybe it is beginning to be recognised that the UK smoking ban was a disaster. UKIP’s Nigel Farage is certainly no fan of the UK smoking ban, and nor is his latest UKIP convert, Douglas Carswell. And as support for UKIP climbs, it would seem that the British people are swinging away from progressivism and towards conservatism. Because UKIP is really just a conservative party, made up of people who liked things the way they used to be (when we were a sovereign state, and controlled our own borders, and people could smoke in pubs, etc, etc.), and who had never really wanted to change everything.

I was never much of a progressive, but these days I seem to be becoming more and more conservative. Because I also liked things the way they used to be (certainly before 1 July 2007), and I never really wanted to change them either. So I vote UKIP now, and will do so for the foreseeable future.

And I’ve always thought the British people are fairly conservative in temperament. And maybe that conservatism is beginning to re-surface. But if so, it’s doing so in a political climate where all the UK mainstream political parties (and the media too) are thoroughly progressivist, including David Cameron’s Conservative party.

But if the British people are swinging conservative, that will force all the ‘progressive’ mainstream parties to (unwillingly) also become more conservative. It’s already beginning to happen in small ways with Cameron’s Conservatives.

But maybe a few of these ‘progressives’ will start to be asked why they always want to change everything, and why they are so full of hate for the world in which they find themselves.

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About Frank Davis

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20 Responses to Progressives and Conservatives

  1. harleyrider1978 says:

    In one simple word THEYRE INSANE!

    Nothing they come up with solves anything,in fact they invent problems where none were to start with so they can claim a need to solve the problem. When all along they were just trying to outlaw something else or gain another tax. They always have ulterior motives. Take the Pre-cautionary Principle.

    Why would anybody need such a thing unless they had an agenda that well was based upon JUNK SCIENCE and very slimey so called evidence to begin with. Without a principle that basically takes NO PROOF and then makes it real proof already has built the foundation for plastic reasoning to be built with a solid foundation based upon DOUBT!

    Then well you just keep feeding it until its a mountain of so called facts based upon a plastic doubt to begin with.

    We can name them now its easy:

    SHS, GLOBALWARMING/CLIMATE CHANGE and now we can add in the first bogus claim direct smoking claims. Theres a myriad of others like the early 90s banning of CFC’s claiming they ate holes in the ozone layer. There wasn’t any proof but they did have a reason as the new green companies were coming online invested in by the likes of AL GORE and others they had to kill DUPONTS patent on Freon. How else to do it to a multi billion dollar a year industry but to outlaw the only producer of said product and then force mandate a change over to the newer patent holder aka green companies. The problem was it took nearly 3 times the new Freon to get the same cooling capacity as the original. Meaning larger evaporator coils and condenser coils. Oh they’ve finally gotton those dimensions down with better more potent refrigerants for smaller sized systems.

    But they purposely destroyed an industry to supply their own peoples/progressive greens product via wholsale criminal intent to destroy that product and move the ” save the earth” movement that much further ahead.

    That’s just one example of abusing political authority to destroy another,no less than what they’ve done to smokers and cigarette companies. The even went as far in one floriduh lawsuit as to stop big tobacco from even being able to introduce evidence in their own defense! Simple as stated from what I remember was the council said all their studies are suspect as they lied to everyone for decades as was put out by the RICO case against the defendants and the leftist judge agreed!

    Then the SHS boogieman used against smokers…………….

    In simple terms the leftist/progressives have always used JUNK SCIENCE to move their political agendas and to fund them and themselves.

    The use of Junk Science is as old as the WITCH DOCTOR and the Chief of a Tribe working together to control the masses and have their way…….

    Is it new,nope not a damn bit! Who was it that wrote the Devine rights of Kings!

    Who invented slavery or caste systems the ones who had the weapons be it knowledge,superstition or control of the media or the Bible or government or the POPE and church Dogma,the selling of forgiveness to sinners!

    Everyhting is aimed at one thing! CONTROL!

    • harleyrider1978 says:

      All we ever wanted was just to be left alone……………nothing more, nothing less!

      But we get screwed and so we go to war against our oppressors and low and behold we find out more than we ever wanted to. We end up fighting them across the political divides,the religious divides,across scientific divides…………..we find out things we never had any reason to question nor even care about. But as the chains we were shackled with grew from one soul to another innocent soul we found ourselves fighting their battles too!

      All leading back to the same sources,our enemy was our neighbors enemy and we never even talked to each other about it nor cared to until we all became its victims.

      So now regardless of your affiliations we all fight the same enemy and for our own reasons or the same doesn’t matter……….the world has found who the enemy is and they are mad! they are striking back everywhere the world over against these Oppressors!

      These Oppressors are progressives and liberal and Rinos and socialists and communists and and and ………………

      Until the might of political will with the populace becomes so embolden the political will for Nannystate laws and other such movements is over!

      It gets Finnito as the politicians finally submit that its all become to much and a liability to their own existence! That’s when change happens……………..

      Damn I am long winded…………………

    • Some French bloke says:

      The use of Junk Science is as old as the WITCH DOCTOR and the Chief of a Tribe working together to control the masses and have their way

      That would mean that theirs really is a retrogressive mindset… (:·)

      • harleyrider1978 says:

        Sorta reminds me of a movie where a guy knew Haleys comet would sling by and exactly when and used his knowledge to well become a god to the people…………….they thought he had godlike powers after that!

        Just think some folks actually believe a whiff of SHS will kill them!

        While standing there beside the smoker who is smoking it all in,they must think the smoker is a god too by the same token~

  2. harleyrider1978 says:

    Wanna see something awesome watch this one OMG!

  3. harleyrider1978 says:

    Ad Review: The Truth? Latest Anti-Smoking Effort Is a Hot Mess

    Using Paparazzi Shots of Smoking Celebrities and Calling Them Idiots Is Cheap

    With great power comes great responsibility. Spider-Man’s uncle said that once. And if it’s good enough for Spider-Man’s uncle, it’s good enough for the folks over at the American Legacy Foundation. In the latest iteration of its “Truth” campaign, the group switches gears from getting kids to stop smoking to getting celebrities to stop smoking — while blaming them for teen smoking and calling them unwitting dupes of Big Tobacco.

    The group ran a couple of spots during the 2014 MTV Video Music Awards. The first spot features paparazzi photos of Orlando Bloom, Robert Pattinson, Rihanna, Chris Brown and a host of others, cigarettes hanging from their mouths and the words “UNPAID TOBACCO SPOKESPERSON” stamped over their faces. “They’re the new face of Big Tobacco. And they don’t even know it,” the ad continues.

    I’m sure the kids watching all screamed, “Dude, sick burn!” in unison. Or maybe they wondered just who American Legacy was talking to here? The celebrities? Publishers? Photographers? The audience?
    Who knows? The premise and execution are, as the kids say, a hot mess
    http://adage.com/article/ad-review/ad-review-truth-latest-anti-smoking-effort-a-hot-mess/294751/

    • harleyrider1978 says:

      In the second ad, American Legacy says the first ad might have “pissed off” the lawyers of the celebrities — tee-hee, they’re so edgy. Then the smoking celebrities are shown again and called unpaid spokespeople again. Then American Legacy claims it’s not “against these people.” Huge fans, as it turns out! Then the ad repeats the notion that every time a smoking photo gets posted, Big Tobacco gets tons of free marketing. Therefore, don’t post smoking selfies, kids.

      American Legacy is making no damn sense and they don’t even know it. I don’t have a lot of sympathy for celebrities, but these people aren’t posting or printing photos of themselves smoking. Rather, they’re having a private moment enjoying a perfectly legal (if harmful) activity out of sight of their fans. How would the folks at American Legacy like it if someone came along and snapped pics of them picking their noses or something?

      American Legacy is trying to talk to teens (I think) about what’s really cool or lame.

      Know what’s lame? Trashing a bunch of celebrities, then saying, “Nah, just kidding, bro. We’re good,” in the next spot. Such a Bieber move. At least have the courage to stand behind the shade you’re throwing. Even if it’s incoherent junior-high-level shade.

  4. harleyrider1978 says:

    Smoking-related idiopathic interstitial pneumonia

    Cigarette smoking is a key factor in the development of numerous pulmonary diseases.

    An international group of clinicians, radiologists and pathologists evaluated patients with previously identified idiopathic interstitial pneumonia (IIP) to determine unique features of cigarette smoking. Phase 1 (derivation group) identified smoking-related features in patients with a history of smoking (n=41). Phase 2 (validation group) determined if these features correctly predicted the smoking status of IIP patients (n=100) to participants blinded to smoking history. Finally, the investigators sought to determine if a new smoking-related interstitial lung disease phenotype could be defined.

    Phase 1 suggested that preserved forced vital capacity with disproportionately reduced diffusing capacity of the lung for carbon monoxide, and various radiographic and histopathological findings were smoking-related features. In phase 2, the kappa coefficient among clinicians was 0.16 (95% CI 0.11–0.21), among the pathologists 0.36 (95% CI 0.32–0.40) and among the radiologists 0.43 (95% CI 0.35–0.52) for smoking-related features. Eight of the 100 cases were felt to represent a potential smoking-related interstitial lung disease.

    Smoking-related features of interstitial lung disease were identified in a minority of smokers and were not specific for smoking. This study is limited by its retrospective design, the potential for recall bias in smoking history and lack of information on second-hand smoke exposure. Further research is needed to understand the relationship between smoking and interstitial lung disease.

    http://erj.ersjournals.com/content/44/3/594.abstract

    • BrianB says:

      “This study is limited by…” the fact that it’s a pile of crap!

      “But please give us some money, and we will do some proper (ie ‘further’) research.”

      Tell me the old, old story.

      ‘kin’ ‘ell!

  5. Some French bloke says:

    But maybe a few of these ‘progressives’ will start to be asked why they always want to change everything

    The monumental piece of social engineering that is TC may well have ulterior motives having nothing to do with health, after all over six decades, they’ve never achieved anything positive in that area. And these motives may have nothing even remotely or parodically ‘progressive’.

    All the strategies of the non-radical left are in fact non-strategies; they are merely day-to-day adjustments to the vicissitudes of the imploding system. And if the powers that be want, like Il Gattopardo (the Leopard), to “Change everything so that nothing changes,” the candidates of the left believe it is possible to change life without touching the power of monopolies.” (From ‘The Implosion of Contemporary Capitalism’ by Samir Amin)

    Other, far more powerful monopolies managed to get total control of ‘Big Tobacco’, which was made abundantly clear in the way the MSA (Master Settlement Agreement) was reached back in 1998. With their pitiful line of defense, tobacco representatives totally embraced the role of ideal scapegoat, proving they had completely lost their status as an independent entity.

    Another well-known quote from ‘The Leopard’ by Giuseppe di Lampedusa is ‘The essential prerequisite for anyone who seeks to lead is the ability to deceive oneself’, IOW those outside the ‘citadel’ are more likely to discover the real motives behind what can be described as a ‘practical joke on a world-wide scale’, than those zealots inside.

  6. herefreeman says:

    “the only way back then of living a life of leisure was to force other people to do all the work.”

    Kind of like today. The taxpayers work and the “progressives” take from them and give it to those living the life of leisure, with food stamps and housing.

    • beobrigitte says:

      You sure have never had to feed your family on income support. The short time I had to was no “life of leisure, with food stamps and housing”. It was incredibly hard, there was only basics and a lot of bills to be paid.
      It’s not a lifestyle of choice and it’s only a very few (like the weird guy who set his house on fire and accidentally killed his children) who think they have it sorted.
      The majority of state benefit recipients use it as it was intended. A short term help.

      • herefreeman says:

        “You sure have never had to feed your family on income support.” You are absolutely correct on that, how could you tell??? “The majority of state benefit recipients use it as it was intended. ” Now on that statement you are wrong.
        I have no problem assisting those that need temporary help. I have a problem with the second and 3rd generation that think that is the way life is. Good luck to you friend I hope you have made it past the point of total dependency on taxpayers.

        In the USA the agriculture department boasts they assist 46 million people with food stamps. The Interior department posts signs that say “Do not feed the wildlife” If you feed them they will not learn to fend for themselves!!

        • beobrigitte says:

          Good luck to you friend I hope you have made it past the point of total dependency on taxpayers.
          I am in a position to retire from work – prior to retirement age. The temporary state help I took was to enable university + work following.

          “You sure have never had to feed your family on income support.” You are absolutely correct on that, how could you tell??? “The majority of state benefit recipients use it as it was intended. ” Now on that statement you are wrong.
          Am I?
          Oh, btw, I also paid off the mortgage for my house.

          Perhaps a little less of state directed attacks on benefit recipients is in order? I can assure you that benefit = bare necessities. Often less than that. I remember it well.
          Those who live on benefits second/third generation and have ‘a great life’ must be resorting to illegal activities.

        • herefreeman says:

          “Perhaps a little less of state directed attacks on benefit recipients is in order?” What kind of response is that?? You’ve done well, ready to retire, good for you. I am so glad temporary assistance helped you, that is what it’s about.

        • beobrigitte says:

          “Perhaps a little less of state directed attacks on benefit recipients is in order?”

          With growing concern I watch the media driven attacks on people in receipt of state benefit.
          Even your first response implicated that you did not believe any benefit recipient would ever be in a position to become self sufficient again once caught up in the state benefit cycle.

          Sure, a rather weird minority of people think they are clever – the idiot who accidentally killed his kids when wanting a bigger house. Prior to that he was on TV proudly showing off his 2 “wives” and numerous kids. The media picks out the one or two in order to insult the people who currently are doing what I did. And not all are as lucky as I was – the university waived the fee for my postgraduate education. Others will take longer than I did to get to the same end result.

          btw, I also raised 3 children as a single parent under 10 when attending university. I also know about the “lone parent stigma”, too.

          Please do reflect on your attitude to benefit recipients. It is the isolated pickets of benefit recipients who have not much of a clue (and are mostly rather strange people!) the media pick up on.

  7. V says:

    Can’t remember on which thread I saw it, but on a Guardian article the other day chronicling the plight of the Yazidis who’d be driven up the mountain by ISIS, an elderly man was quoted saying, “We don’t even have cigarettes”. A couple of commenters below the line took it upon themselves to mock this, with one even saying it’s a “positive” that has come out of the ISIS story. I nearly cried and I feel sick even remembering it now. These people don’t and will never understand, and haven’t a shred of decency among them. Had the elderly man said, “I haven’t even a treadmill or weights to do my daily workout on” no doubt Guardianistas would be crying into their lentils. They make me sick.

    • beobrigitte says:

      Can’t remember on which thread I saw it, but on a Guardian article the other day chronicling the plight of the Yazidis who’d be driven up the mountain by ISIS, an elderly man was quoted saying, “We don’t even have cigarettes”. A couple of commenters below the line took it upon themselves to mock this, with one even saying it’s a “positive” that has come out of the ISIS story.

      Then let’s send these commenters to live under ISIS law.

  8. beobrigitte says:

    And as support for UKIP climbs, it would seem that the British people are swinging away from progressivism and towards conservatism. Because UKIP is really just a conservative party, made up of people who liked things the way they used to be (when we were a sovereign state, and controlled our own borders, and people could smoke in pubs, etc, etc.), and who had never really wanted to change everything.

    This is EXACTLY how people think and feel! Being a public transport user for a short period of time (DVLA does not allow road tax to be paid unless there is a piece of paper I never received from them in the first place!) is quite refreshing.
    The taxi driver I spoke to smokes in his cab – his tobacco is visible and that lovely smell I remember in cabs was there – has no time for prohibitionists.
    On the platform of my local train station everyone SMOKES or vapes.
    On the way back I had to wait 20 minutes for a train. On the platform I smoked a cig and found myself surrounded by 2 lads whose intentions I could not make out. Being me, I anchored my rucksack firmly to land a few blows if need be. Then I heard one of them asking some other passengers if they had a cig. THAT changed EVERYTHING. I went over, gave the lad a gob full for being “weird” (if you do THAT again I’ll dance on yer head!”) and then handed over a few cigs.
    Next came an announcement over the speakers: IT IS FORBIDDEN TO CARRY ALCOHOL ON THE TRAINS. IF CAUGHT YOU FACE A PENALTY.
    Right. Prohibition at it’s best. Will test it!

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